Suzanne Winterflood: Breaking Down Barriers in STEM

Stuart Murray  0:00  
This podcast was recorded on the ancestral lands, on treaty one territory, the traditional territory of the Anishinaabe Cree Oji Cree Dakota and the Dene peoples, and on the homeland of the Metis nation.

Amanda Logan (Voiceover)  0:20  
This is humans on rights, a podcast advocating for the education of human rights. Here's your host, Stuart Murray.

Stuart Murray  0:31  
This is a podcast about people because human rights aren't abstract. They're shaped by excess opportunity. And who gets included? Today's conversation starts early with education, because the right to learn to explore science and technology is not shared equally. That's why I'm speaking with Suzanne winter flood, the program manager of wise kinetic energy, an organization breaking down barriers in STEM for young people, especially girls, indigenous youth and communities that have been historically excluded. So this isn't a conversation about programs. It's about equity representation and what it means to invest in the human potential. Suzanne Winterflood, welcome to humans on rights. Pleasure to be here. Suzanne, can you maybe introduce yourself to our listeners and explain what you do.

Suzanne Winterflood  1:23  
I'm the Program Manager here at wisekinetic energy. Wise kinetic energy is the largest outreach program for STEM education in Manitoba. I have been with the organization quite short time. Its presence was there well before me. We've been around for 3536 years, and we started it off very small, just Women in Science Group. It was set up by a couple of professors here to to reach out and encompass and include more girls in programming, in an engineering and in science and all this, all things, for those that don't know STEM is science, technology, education and math, and some people now include the arts in there, and it becomes steep. And we do that a little bit, but we are very much stem focused. But I think that's going to probably broaden along with the world that we live in, and the way in which these things happen. So we offer programming throughout the year. We have workshops, about 20 workshops that we offer across Manitoba to schools. So really, within the school year, it's, it's sort of an out within Winnipeg, and then up to about an hour and a half outside of Winnipeg, if you take the sort of the compass into our big circles, go out there and an hour and a half. So we go outside Portugal prairie, we go to Ortona wincler and those sort of places, and our we hire and we train and hire undergraduate students to facilitate those workshops and to deliver what we what we have and what we take out into community. Those young students come from a variety of backgrounds, are male, female, all sorts of diverse representation, but they they have a passion for stem so they become the role models, and you go out into community, as I say, we have about 20 workshops that teachers can book. They have to book two hours. Otherwise it becomes quite difficult to manage. We're flexible, and we in how we work with our students, with their study and their timetables are of paramount importance, of course, but this gives them a massive opportunity to learn leadership skills and presentation skills, and many of them come through the education path, or are very interested in education, so they get to develop some of those skills too. Then outside of those workshops, we also run special clubs and events. So these groups are more either for girls and also we have black youth that we reach and that we have very specific programming, and that program is generally free. Some some of it we charge for, but for the most part, it's it's free programming. We so we'd have programming for black youth. We have a black youth club with girls clubs. We have a robotic Fight Club, which is girls that join, and they do about eight weeks that's running currently. They're all running currently, but the robot fight club, they learn how to program and build robots, and then they actually enter the Manitoba robot Robot Wars in middle of April. It changes slightly each year. So they again, they girls are getting experience in coding and building robots and all things tech and having the fun of competing our black youth in STEM workshop clubs. We take them into the community. We have partners such as ercom, which is the immigrant refugee of Manitoba.

Stuart Murray  4:59  
Yeah. Kim. New manager. But no, you got it? Yeah, I've had them on the podcast, so I know, but yeah.

Suzanne Winterflood  5:06  
So we have partners like Emma. We have another part of Paul Ignite, which is another program that runs during the summer, and we always looking for new partners. So our black youth in STEM programming, and is, again, all of these programs are developed to bridge the gap between you know, and to be able to bring these topics and opportunities of career and focus to marginal what generally are marginalized groups. For example, girls in and women in STEM there. There's about only 30% to 35% of jobs in STEM are even attributed to females. So there's a there's a big bias towards that the male employees, and similarly, with black youth, black individuals make up about 11% of all jobs, but only 9% of them in STEM jobs, and then they don't, and there's like a 33,000 worker a gap in the black community, so between the white and the black other, let's say so it really, really matters, because of the amount of diversity that can be brought into these fields, but also just making sure people have good role models that can access all of this. And we have camps that we run through the summer, which we take out into rural communities. And we have spring workshops that we do again. We go out to about six different schools. We go out to Flin Flon. We go to Pina mo Tang, sapatoac, Swan

Stuart Murray  6:40  
Lake, Swan River.

Suzanne Winterflood  6:42  
That's one river. There's a lot for sure. And again, we take our workshop series into those schools so that where they wouldn't ordinarily get a lot of access system.

Stuart Murray  6:55  
So it sounds like you've got, like, a quite a robust and we're going to get into that Suzanne. But what I'm fascinated a little bit about, just a, you know, you've been there for about 18 months now as the as the program manager. What were you just talk, talk us a little bit about, you know, how did Suzanne winter flood become the program manager? I mean, you know, you're you. How did you get interested in STEM and by being a part of this, and just share a bit of your background, please.

Suzanne Winterflood  7:19  
I came to Canada 18 years ago, from London. Everyone will probably recognize the accent, so it's from from London, England. And I initially worked for seven years with the ICT association of Manitoba, so the sector Council, which is now known as tech Manitoba, and I developed programming for career development and helping people who professionals are coming into the IT sector to find help them to acculturate and learn what it is to be an employee in Manitoba. They had the skills. They had all the tech skills. I didn't. I'm by no means capable of teaching them tech, but there's a business analysts IT support, you know, the whole gambit, but they didn't understand us how to get into the workplace. Companies at that time weren't terribly good at recruiting into from the that community, either. So I developed a program through an exam that was called Workforce Development. I worked with companies and individuals alike, and built this program of matching and recruitment and onboarding, etc. So that was my sort of launch into that sector. I then went on after that. I was an executive director at a multimedia company which was a non non for profit, but we would develop a lot of programming using technology platforms to take technology into the workplace, into projects, done a lot of stuff. We've done the big welding training program in VR, which was the first of its kind at the time, going back then the skyrocketed and changed a lot. So I was, again, still in that tech field. And then after that, I went to a bit of a stint on my own, and then I worked for an organization called the Neil Squire Society, which is based out of Vancouver, and they're a disability organization. And I set up here in Manitoba, their assistive tech, do it yourself, assistive tech, which is all 3d printed and things like that. And I set up that program here no longer existed. It's the same way here now and then I came here. It was like this progression. I've been in leadership roles for a long time, and I applied to the University maniti, where they were advertising for a position here, not the position I work in. Actually, there's a different position that I was invited to take on this role based on my experience, etc, and that's how I ended up here.

Stuart Murray  9:56  
Great life journey, for sure. Suzanne, but you. Just want to get a sense, you clearly have had your own attachment to the whole stem industry. If I can call that, or the stem your Pat you've been passionate about that. You've been involved in technology and so just, just, just, if you back it up, because I, you know, when we focus on on the great work that wise kid netic energy does, which is for, you know, getting introducing people, you have been kind of, you're ahead of that curve. You were very much engaged and so, so what sort of barriers Did you find when you were getting involved in your career, in terms of trying to make a difference, advance yourself, learn, maybe share that, if you will, because I'd love to then come into the great work that is being done by wise kinetic energy.

Suzanne Winterflood  10:45  
I guess my biggest hurdle that I had to overcome was being an immigrant myself.

Stuart Murray  10:51  
Okay, not so much being a woman, but being more of an immigrant

Suzanne Winterflood  10:55  
and a woman. I mean, they're definitely a female. There was definitely a disadvantage, but it is a hurdle, right? The fact that I was coming into leadership roles, I was very lucky. I worked in organizations that were very embracing of females, so I was lucky. In that respect. It sort of path had already been carved out. I've always worked in very small non profits, and when you come to someone like the university, again, coming in a leadership role, but they have a very welcoming environment. So I've been very fortunate as a woman, I would say some of the issues have come that I faced, yes, as an immigrant, it's a very different working culture in the UK, which was quite funny, because I always found I had more in common with the IT professional immigrants I was working with. I had more in common with them than I did some of my colleagues at that time, because we were I was also learning I'd only been here a year when I worked, started to work at ik Tam and and the workplace culture was so different to what I was used to in what way, just the way, the way people communicated. We were now in the world of emails, right? And I had been in that for a while, but in in England, it's very, you know, you're very matter of fact. You write it as it is. You don't, you don't think about upsetting people. It's just like, This is it. And, you know, whereas, like, I did a lot of work in this field, so in Canadian culture, it's what we call the Canadian sandwich, so to speak. Hello. How are you? This is lovely, yes, but you know, we've got this issue we need to deal with. Oh, and have a wonderful week, right?

Stuart Murray  12:40  
Okay, got it nice. I love that.

Suzanne Winterflood  12:44  
Yeah, right thing. But we don't. We never operated like that. That way, that was communication was was very different, different for me, so much so that I was in an advisory I was running an advisory group, and if the person ever listens to this, I know exactly who they are, but I had sent out the minutes of the meeting, and I sent all the information out, and I clearly upset somebody quite a lot by my tone in my email wasn't intended, but it created this big sort of issue that arose out of all of this. And I sort of, you know, oh my goodness. But when you make a mistake, to say a mistake, I mean, it's a cultural mistake, but when you do something like that, it can take six months to a year if you ever get over it and rebuild that. I was very fortunate. I went on to be extremely good friends with this individual, and I meant he was a mentor to me. But it did take some undoing, but it really was just a cultural way of doing things, and I've had to learn that to temper that way, and sometimes I still have to think about it, right, but even the basic things, like I know hole punches. Hole punch here is so different to a hole punch in the UK. And I remember the first time I tried to use one. I had a master's degree. I couldn't work out how to use the hole punch. And I burst into tears because I did. I couldn't put the paper in, you know, silly little things, but things that make a massive impact, right? So, and I think being taken seriously as an immigrant, but as a woman, I do think that when you're when you go into a world that's male dominated, which, at the time, I the IT sector definitely was, but I'm fortunate, I'm a very confident person, right? And I am white, and I have qualifications, and I don't shrink back easily. So for me, yes, it's always been a little bit of a challenge, but not as much of a challenge as probably others have faced.

Stuart Murray  14:58  
Yeah, no, fair enough. And I. And I appreciate you sort of sharing that, because, you know, the whole kind of purpose of our conversation as we focus on the good work is being done by wise kinetic energy. And by the way, I'm just going to take a moment. I know all of these podcasts are transcribed, and people can, you know, follow the dialog along as they want. But you know, I just want to say that it took me a while to sort of do my own research and figure out that wise kid netic energy is capital, W, capital I, capital, S, capital, E, capital, K, small i, small d, dash, capital, N, E T, I, C, capital, e n, e r g y, e n, e r g y, so wise kid netic energy as a playoff sound, kinetic, I suspect, right? Yes, absolutely, yeah, yeah, yeah. So Suzanne, just, you know, kind of looking at, and you know, from the perspective of what's happening there, you know. And I just say, from a human rights perspective, you know, what can you sort of share, what barriers you see preventing certain kids from accessing STEM education, and how does wise kinetic energy actively work to dismantle those barriers.

Suzanne Winterflood  16:06  
Let's start with girls. That was our very first wise is women in STEM engineering, right in science engineering, and that was where we started. I mean, we've broadened our reach over the years, but so let's start with girls. So girls, most children, will enjoy whatever you give them to do, and it's fun. Science can be fun. You know, engineering can be fun. So we, we have always tried to do that. Now we know reaching girls early in life is important to just to so they can explore and introduce the various topics in fun way. As they get to grade eights and nines, they might still be interested, but they start to pull back, they start to see the bias that exists and the struggles of being a female generally, you know, I mean, let's not, you know, as a female, let's, let's be honest. You know, it's, it's not just stem that becomes problematic at times, finding your way as a female. And then if you show an interest in STEM, you automatically become somewhat the minority. I'm not even sure why. I suppose it goes back historically. It was male dominated, and still is in many ways male dominated. Everything about it, and I am ringing ceremony for engineering, nothing about it is terribly welcoming for females. But like the traits, right? Same thing applies. So by having young undergraduate students who act as role models for girls. So if we run Girls Clubs, we use girl we use female students, we like to present information that's you know about others. So I think the barriers, because it's also parents. Parents often stereotype, right? And it depends on what they come from as to where they guide their girls, you know. So there's lots of layers. It's like, you know? It's like the big onion, you know, you peel off, peel off, peel off. And everybody's experience is different. Of course, that's the other thing to remember, schools are doing a lot, but there's funds, funding, right? And so what we do, and they have like, we fit in with curriculum, but we just really tried to make them enjoy. So I think, you know, making that equity, trying to bring up the numbers, there's so many systemic barriers in place that you just need to show that they can do and overcome, and hopefully you inspire at some point with our black youth. Of course, again, you know, it's not a shock to anybody. I don't think that. You know black youth struggle to find their place for so many reasons. They gain such systemic barriers that they face higher levels of microaggressions, you know, sort of they have limited access to mentors and integrated work and learning. So again, our black programming, our black youth programming has really tried to, again, overcome that. We go where we run things here on the on campus, but we also go into community where we have a high level of black representation. Again, it really comes down to encouragement and showing you can do this. And the same is said for indigenous youth here at wise, we do indigenous youth programming, but I have to be honest, it's not been as that. It's not grown how we'd like to. We're looking to grow that this year, if we can get the funding to do that, it fits in with everything around the Truth and Reconciliation. Information and the different calls to action, you know, and to again, making sure that our youth, our indigenous youth, are able to truly access you know, if you go into rural community, you're further north. Well, even you're further north, you don't have to go very far north. And schools, both indigenous communities and rural schools, don't have access. There's not the funding that supports it, so that prevents them from being able to come into this, these fields, and also the just the sheer fear or unknown, or you know, again, those barriers to coming into university. Pretty much all stem activity Careers start at university. Some it you can get by, and you can do things about going to university, let's be honest. But you know, there is a value to coming in and you know, if you want to be an engineer, you've got to come to university. If you want to be a computer science person, you want to come to university. So it really is about breaking that down and hoping that we can address those gaps that exist and we know they're there and which way and

Stuart Murray  21:13  
on that regard, Suzanne, when you look at the mentors, you've got people that go out into the communities, and you talk about black youth, you talk about indigenous youth. These are groups that you know, historically have been sidelined. Are you able to have mentors? You know? I mean, I just think that so often people say and fair comment is, I'd love to, I mean, whether it's medical profession or stem or anything, if I'm going to go somewhere to learn, I'd like to see somebody that looks like me. So from, you know, from the black youth, are you able to get some, some of the black community to be mentors? The same with indigenous Are you able to get some indigenous mentors? Is that? Is that working?

Suzanne Winterflood  21:51  
Yeah, so with our black youth, we definitely, we recruit, we do K to 12 programming, right? So you have young, first, second, third, fourth year engineering students, for example or site students or education, whatever they wherever they fall, they immediately become those mentors to those young people and the role models of what they are doing, because they see themselves in their eyes, right? So we would we don't send white students to black programming. We just don't even on our workshops. We have people from all different backgrounds, you know. So it's all very diverse, but when we focus on black youth, we have black youth students. We're holding an event like a little bit later this month. It's our first black youth in STEM, sort of conference event called roots in STEM. That is that

Stuart Murray  22:44  
in conjunction, by the way, sources that interrupt in conjunction with Black History Month, it

Suzanne Winterflood  22:49  
is, and it's the first time we've done it. We've been very successful with the programming. But we want to bring people together. We're keeping it quite small. It's actually on the 21st of February, and we'll have a series of Marcus chamber. Deputy Mayor Marcus chambers is coming to give briefings. We have Jennifer ladipo, who is from Ottawa, will join us by video conference. She's going to be she's a very successful black engineer and writer, and she's coming in to do a keynote speech, and then we'll run workshops around drones and stuff, and we have all of our black youth undergraduates going to be there to help, and, you know, to do this, and we've got external partners, etc. So we very much work towards that to make sure there's a balance our indigenous youth. We have workshops that we take out into community. We do not have many indigenous youth that actually join us at the moment, or have joined us at the moment as instructors. So this year, we're focusing a lot on building out in in STEM, as we call it, to attract indigenous instructors Young. There's Indigenous students here, but they need more supports. So we're hoping to get an intern, a summer intern. We are hoping to run a big youth indigenous day, which is where we're going to they're going to, you know, hopefully come in, and we'll have groups that then go into different activities, but we want to be able to bring their community leaders and elders, etc, together to try and work out what it is that they need in their communities, for their youth, for us to be able to respond to that and come up with some new programming, some land based programming, It's very culturally specific, and then hopefully build that so that again, they are mentored and work with their elders and learn all that knowledge. Really work hard to that. That's a big focus for us this year. But it all comes down to funding. For sure, it does.

Stuart Murray  24:55  
I mean, like so many things, just as a side note, why is kinetic energy part of the University of. Manitoba, we

Suzanne Winterflood  25:01  
sit within the university. They do tremendously. They support us tremendously. We are independent in what we do, but they definitely support us, and they pay a couple of our staff. We get all of our meeting rooms and our offices for free. There's lots of in kind, and our student staff all become employed through the university, so they they get equitable pay and everything. So yes, we are part of the university, but we are very independent entity. We don't get caught up in the bureaucracies. But yeah, yeah, because

Stuart Murray  25:37  
I that's I just noticed that was on your kind of on your letterhead, on your letterhead, on your email with the University of Manitoba. So I was just trying to sort of get a sense, because you do have, as you say, kindergarten degree 12 programming that you go out into schools and sort of make

Suzanne Winterflood  25:50  
that happen. I think it was because of the two professors that were I think one was in science and one was in engineering back in the day when it started. And so it straddled across two faculties. Now we're very much embedded within the Faculty of Engineering, but they do not they're not prescriptive. We're not seen as being a recruitment arm. However, that's on their product. If we work with the older age groups, which we are, then we look at career focused things with leadership skills, this type of things, as well as STEM in general. But we, they don't say to us, oh, you've got to teach your engineering and all, you've got to do this. We're STEM related, and we're not measured by recruitment and things like that. So it's very much. We're very fortunate. We're very privileged and have that autonomy.

Stuart Murray  26:40  
Yeah, yeah. No, that's great. Yeah, that's great. So, so Suzanne, you know, when you think about, you know, your role as program manager of wise kinetic energy, when you, when you look at, sort of the the bigger picture. And again, I'm going to drive it back a bit, if you don't mind to sort of human rights, because this is a human rights podcast, but, but I'd love to get your sort of sense of how you look at, you know, early exposure to sort of science and technology that can shape a child's sense of belonging and possibility. And I'm looking to get your sense of how do you see, how do you see that, or do you see it as a rights issue and just not an education one like it. Just, would love to get your sense on that perspective.

Suzanne Winterflood  27:24  
Yeah, I think it is multifaceted. It absolutely is a right to me. Everybody should have the right to equal access to education, whatever that looks like, but understanding that what that looks like it's different for different people in the terms of not the core learning, but the way in which you relate it to them. So I think from from that respect, it is, is very much an equalities and equity piece, I guess, as well. If people don't see themselves in roles, then they self, eliminate them, or put their own barriers in let's say they put their own barriers. They don't really put their own barriers, these invisible barriers that just keep going and going and going. So by giving early exposure, you really are hoping to just open the door to thought and innovation, right? And as you go through that old, I mean, the little ones, little ones are going to do stuff because it's fun, right? It doesn't, you know they're going to do it. But as you, as I say, when you get to the older age groups, when they're starting to think about what they want to do with life, sadly, we're so young these days, and we've always have, but, you know, but they reach grade nine and them to think about what they're going to do for the next two years. And sometimes you've got young people that are coming from different countries, different backgrounds, you know, it for all manner of reasons, and may never have seen themselves, even in these situations, let alone in this completely different environment, in this different country, so many young people, certainly those of color, go end up going into games, right? We know this. It's sad, because it's they become as an affinity, because, hey, come join us. We'll be your friend, right? So we want to try and stop that. We want to be able to give them positive roles that they can and information that they can, they can see themselves as something different, and have a sense of belonging to the community that we're in. I mean, really, we are about building community. You know, kids will go through workshops in schools that supplements but our core values of moving, you know, really giving opportunity to social economic groups, those that really can't afford to do this and don't get access. So that is very much an equity thing. A human rights issue. Why? Why are we still quite frankly, I asked myself, Why are we still having to do this? I mean, I'm of a certain age. I've been around a while. I've worked in different countries, and this story is the same as it was when I was young. It's not changed. Yes, you see a few more girls here, and more in leadership roles, and you see a few more girls there. And I've never done the stats on it myself, but I do wonder, you know, okay, fine, but is it truly a statistical difference that we've made, or are we just a bigger population, so we see more girls, because that's just a faith. You know, it's going to happen that way. I don't know that, but I do worry about the fact that I am all these many years later. I started working in this stuff when I was 18. I still now all these years on, I'm no longer 18. My white hair shows it, but I really do it bothers me that we're still fighting the same issues. The needle's not really moved that far.

Stuart Murray  31:09  
Where do you think public systems are falling short when it comes to equitable STEM education?

Suzanne Winterflood  31:14  
I think, honestly, it comes down to funding. I think there's a lot being done in certain areas, or people are trying to, there's a willingness, but it's money, it's fine, and it costs a lot to do these things. You know, if we run program for indigenous youth, I do not have the funds to give the supports that they really need, right? We're talking about so many barriers, you know, transportation, just having people that are with you, bringing people in, bringing youth in them, finding people to accompany them. If they're coming in from outside of Winnipeg, any real distance, there has to be a combination. If they're going to, you know, need maybe to stay overnight once or twice. So that costs a lot, and being able to access that Canada's it's not like going in in England. I used to work in this stuff, not indigenous stuff, of course, I used to work in non profit. There was abundance of charities and money, not everybody. You know, if you didn't get this, you got that. I think in the US, it used to be the same, and I'm not sure this. Oh, it's like now, but, but again, we have these smaller pots of money. But I think there's people tend to put their own barriers in place. Oh, yeah, well, you know, we can't do that. Oh no, there's going to cost this much. Oh well, you know, so and so is doing that. I'm also big on partners. We need to come together to be able to progress. And it's very hard to do that because there's only a certain amount of money around I've been able to access. So from a from a systems and institutionalized way of doing things, I think, you know, again, you know, there's areas of conservatism that prevents things, there's there's budgets, there's racial bias. I mean, you know, it exists and it's not, you know, however you dress it up, it's there and and it prevents, it can prevent true equity. So it's just that. But there's lots of good people out there doing things for sure.

Stuart Murray  33:28  
Oh, absolutely, yeah, for sure. It always

Suzanne Winterflood  33:31  
comes down to money. That's the bottom line. I just

Stuart Murray  33:32  
find it interesting that, as you say, that you've been at this for quite a while and you haven't already seen the needle move. And you know, I know that, you know the amount of tension that's trying to sort of get more women involved in engineering and some of these other programming, some of these other great opportunities. And I mean, the point is, is, it's not a force thing. It's just saying, you know, you have the opportunity to do it, but if you feel there's a barrier there, and as you say, you know, people will start to look at something else, as opposed to, sort of going into into, kind of the whole stem, kind of piece of it. But, you know, I guess I wonder, how do you, I mean, from your perspective now, as you're sitting there as the program manager of wise kinetic energy, do you have a sense Suzanne, sort of beyond numbers and participation, about, how do you get a sense that your work, or the work of your organization, is actually starting to to break down some of these barriers, to move this discussion forward. So I

Suzanne Winterflood  34:28  
think we are also part of a larger network across Canada. So there's lots, there's lots going on across Canada. I think the other thing is, things are getting very consumed with AI right now. So that's the buzz, right and it's detracting from a lot of the true work. If we look at how government money is being spent, it's being spent with great big AI initiatives, workforce development. And what they forget is that the young people that have got come up to green workforce, yeah, they are our workforce. And if you're five or six now, they're just as important, because you are the future. So I think, yes, there's all these things going on, but the target, the ideal, is, oh, let's get the grade elevens and twelves. They've already been shaped by them in many ways. Now that's not to say that we don't do work because we do, but every age group is as important, and I think, as well, with the advent of technology as it has become people, it's so vast, right? And technology cuts across everything, no matter what. So that's a very, very important part of what we do. But science, you know, it's all cross cutting it, you know. So if you want to follow science, you still need to be able to understand and tap into the technologies that are going to take you further and innovate. And I think understanding institutional systems have to understand it's not just cut and dried. And I think, you know, there's a lot about, oh, workforce, workforce, workforce, that they forget is it's got to go across everybody. It's not something that just happens. And I say, I've worked in workforce development in this country since, you know, in 18 years, for 18 years on and off. And you know now people are talking about massive shortages. So you've got to focus on the needs and listen to what organizations like us and others are saying, and put time and energy into that to enable our girls, our black youth, our indigenous youth and all those marginalized groups to be able to take their rightful place in the world, right because they are the future. It's not. It doesn't look the demographic doesn't look like it used to. And why should? It should never, and we want to continue to do that.

Stuart Murray  37:11  
When you took on the role as program manager at at wise kinetic energy, what you thought coming in, and now you've been there for 18 months. What? What do you what

Suzanne Winterflood  37:23  
do you see? It's interesting because it takes a good year to get him on boarded. I mean, six months, depending on the job. But, you know, so I've only been here 18 months, and my first year was really just getting to know everything, the systems and trying to reorganize. We, even as an organization, we have changed our internal workings, if you want in that time. For me, I guess really, when I came in, I didn't really know. I'll be honest with you, I don't, I don't think I really know what I was coming into. I knew it was a program. I'd looked at it, the fact that I'd applied for a different job and got invited into this one, I didn't really know what it was coming into. In that way that said it what I did know it aligned with my own values, right? I mean, you know, I've got daughters, I've got granddaughters, but they're very privileged. I'm very privileged, you know, let's be honest. But that the appeal for me was as as has always been, working with people that aren't as fortunate. And so in the time I've been here, I've learned a lot about what we do or what our mission. We've changed our mission, vision and values statement quite a bit, but, you know, it's at the heart of it still there. We've done some strategic planning to look at where we want to go. I think the biggest thing I've learned is we just have to keep pushing through and trying to get ourselves as an organization. We have a big reach. We reach like 43,000 youth a year, and yet very few people know about us, and we do not get the level of funds that we really need. We do have corporate, companies and stuff that support us, but we could do so much more because we're well placed to do that. And I think that's something I've learned as a about the program. I've learned a lot about the different education groups, and, you know, the demographics of who we include and where those gaps truly exist. I always worked with adults before, so they were already shaped and formed and they changed careers. Was there an immigrant they couldn't stay in the career they've taught us? Yeah. So this is the first time in a long time that I've truly worked with youth. I mean, I did a bit in the UK, but and that was black youth, different again, but it's been a long time to come. I've come full circle in my own sort of career. But I think truly, just understanding all these groups of young people, they actually want to do this stuff. They want to. Do it. They're excited about it. What you've gotta do is keep them excited and then give them the opportunities. If there's nothing worse and nothing more deflating than you know, you work down hard, you're thoroughly interested, and then you can't get a job, you know, or no one's tricking you seriously, or you've got all these extras, barriers that you've got to jump. But I think teaching that, you know, you can get there, and giving those roles positive role models, it's just crucial,

Stuart Murray  40:31  
if somebody was listening to this podcast and wanted to get involved in either supporting stem or supporting, you know, the what you do, sort of at wise kinetic energy. What would you advise them to do

Suzanne Winterflood  40:44  
if they're if they're a student in any of the institutions within Venezuela? Winnipeg? I invite them to apply and come and meet with us. We're always looking for volunteers at events. We do. We do several big events as well, as well as our clubs. If they're interested in earning, we want to, I'd like to, I really do want to start a high school intern program. We're going to introduce some new leadership camps this year. So if that's where you see yourself and you want to do then, then watch our watch our website, you know, watch our social media, follow our social media, learn about us, reach out to us. Here, does it now? And we have very, a very small core team of four running this program. So you know, we it can take a time for us to get back to things. If you are representing companies that have a corporate social responsibility arm, then we want your money. Yeah. Okay, great. Yeah. You want the more money we've got, the more we can so if you know, and we do get donations, and we have a donate button on our website, but we also have companies that reach out to us directly, and if you're interested in, if you have children that you want to participate. Watch the website. Look at what we do our workshops. We offer as much as we can, bilingual in French, at the moment, in French and English, but we don't always get French speaker instructors and so. But we do like to have materials revamped and looked at, I'm also looking at developing a couple of advisory groups, talking circles, etc, to help us, guide us. Because it's also about guiding, if you're from, if you're from school divisions and superintendents and admins, and you know, I want to hear from you, because I'd love to have them involved in what we do and the Reach teachers will book us. But you know, it's if you get the administrators on board, we can do even more

Stuart Murray  42:53  
what your social media, if people are listening to this. I mean, you have a website.

Suzanne Winterflood  42:57  
We do. We have an Instagram site, which is at wise kinetic

Stuart Murray  43:02  
I think that's okay. Oh, no, we'll put it on.

Suzanne Winterflood  43:04  
Yeah. We'll get it. Yeah, yeah. We have a Facebook, Facebook website as well as wise kinetic energy.ca. If someone's out there that's interested in supporting us to help with doing our social media, that's one of the problems that's time consuming. And also our website needs some summary. So those professional skills are also very valuable to us. If people are able to donate time for some of those tasks, incredibly useful, because it's how we elevate ourselves and market ourselves to best effect.

Stuart Murray  43:41  
Yeah, well, always something to do. As you say, you're a small shop and a big and a big, big area to cover. I know you're a small shop, it was difficult to get you because you're very busy and you're doing a lot of traveling, and you're working hard, and that's a good sign. Suzanne, so, so that's fantastic, but, but I just want to say Suzanne winter flood, the program manager for wise kinetic energy. Thank you so much for finding some time to participate in the conversation on humans on rights.

Suzanne Winterflood  44:07  
Thank you. Thank you. Appreciate the time.

Matt Cundill  44:11  
Thanks for listening to humans on rights. A transcript of this episode is available by clicking the link in the show notes of this episode. Humans on rights is recorded and hosted by Stuart Murray, social media marketing by Buffy Davey, music by Doug Edmond. For more, go to human rights hub.ca

Amanda Logan (Voiceover)  44:32  
produced and distributed by the sound off media company