Mary Anne Ivison: The Power of The Pivot

Mary Ann Iverson is a radio broadcaster, voiceover pro and loves the outdoors.

I'm not sure if that's listed on her Tinder profile or she even has a Tinder profile.

You know what I forgot to ask.

She's worked in the Ottawa market for Rogers and later bells pure country before being restructured about a year ago.

Since then.

She's upped her voice over business and getting ready for 2022.

Mary.

Ann Iverson joins me from Canada's nation's capital of Ottawa Marianne.

Where does the story begin for you?

I grew up in a very small town.

It's called tilbury in Ontario Southwestern Ontario in between about Windsor and London, two siblings, wonderful parents were all still really close and uh, I grew up playing outside and playing on the farm.

My dad still has a couple 100 acres and that's my safe and happy place did you grow on the farm growing up?

We did a lot of corn, beans, wheat.

That situation never really had any livestock by any means.

I remember we used to, my dad would grow like a few rows of popcorn every year.

We would go pick up the popcorn just, just so we could pop and grow our own popcorn.

I remember those remember those days, but of course I had family members who live next door down the road.

Right.

And there was always no chickens around and there's always sometimes turkeys and livestock and yeah, that was kind of my, my first introduction into my love longstanding love of nature.

And then why radio?

You're just diving right into the deepest of questions.

Right?

Why radio?

So I always thought, I thought I was really smart.

I thought that I was going to go into kinesiology.

I thought I was going to go into sport.

I thought I was going to help people that way and I realized I was terrible at science.

Always, never got good grades.

I took great 11 kinesiology and not that almost failed, but it wasn't good.

It wasn't, wasn't good enough.

I was always good at english.

Was always good at what do you want to call them softer?

The arts.

Thank you.

You should see the smile on his face right now, the arts.

I was always better at the arts and I was like, oh, maybe maybe communications is the way to go.

Being a teenager is a really confusing time.

I co opted a radio station in Chatham Ontario and I liked it.

I was good at it, went to college in Canis.

Toga was really good at it, loved it, loved production, liked being on air and that's where my love started and realized I was surrounded with by a bunch of weirdos at college who were just like me.

Why did you call yourself weird.

Usually I'm surrounded by weirdos.

They're weird.

But you included yourself in the bunch.

I felt like I'm like, oh, these are my people.

I am part of the weird.

Yeah, I'm part of that, I'm part of that, I'm not calling them weirdos.

I'm calling us weirdos.

So what made you so weird?

What made me so weird?

Because you couldn't get into kinesiology because you only got like an 80 instead of a 95, which is what they asked for to get into it.

I realized that I felt like myself.

I felt like the weird jokes and you were like, radio radio people are, I feel like I don't even need to explain to myself why radio people are weird.

Well, they've all been bunked on their head at one point or another and I think they feel a need to speak out, they can't speak out and the radio is sort of the way to do it, to go find yourself to go sort something out maybe from the past, Right?

And now I'm in my early 30s and I'm still, you know, sorting through what that looks like too right and kind of post radio life.

But I think I just felt most like myself when I was in Radio college at Conestoga, I never thought I would, I would be good at this.

But I always, I loved producing, I loved editing audio and realized I'm like, oh, I'm really good at this.

I thought I was going to be a producer.

Like I remember when I was even called like, oh, this is what I want to do and then I got on air and then that was most of my career other than a little bit of marketing here and there.

But for the most part it turned into an on air career, what was the first time you walked into a radio station and we're going to get a paycheck for it?

It was at C.

F.

C.

O.

In Chatham, they didn't have O A C.

When you could just do like 1/5 year.

So I did 1/5 year, did the coop at C.

F.

C.

O.

And I remember walking in and like you're just this kid and there's these radio personalities right?

But you grew up listening to and they're like the rock stars to you and they drove around the free car that I got from the dealership down the street and it was like logoed up.

I just remember thinking that on air radio people were rock stars who are the rock stars in your life.

The biggest was dave and chuck the freak And Lisa Way they were at 89 x at the time in Windsor and now they're at the riff in Detroit, they made that switch, oh gosh, I don't know how many years ago unfortunately, you know things change and people leave and people move around but ironically they switched 89 X.

The station, the Iraq station I grew up with to a pure country which was the brand I used to work for at Bell Media.

It's kind of gut wrenching when the station you grew up on flips and bails out.

I mean it really sort of, it's quite triggering.

I just want to be with the cool kids and use that word, that's an accurate word when they, you know and I don't want to speak ili of my past employer by any means but that's just the way things go as you take brands like the pure brand or the move Brandon Bell or the Rogers country brands or whatever that looks like and you plop them all over and it makes sense business wise for sure.

I understand but at the same time a station you grew up with most of your childhood and then then it's switching and you still work there when they switched and it's it's very confusing.

It's very confusing is the right word because you're sad but you're also like well this is it's a business decision and I understand it.

Yeah, let's not forget across the way over in Detroit they did the same thing.

I think it was the audience see station went and plunked in an alternative probably about a half hour after the after 89 X left the air that void was very quickly filled.

I didn't even know this this is how disconnected I am.

Bill's not the only company that that can go and and sweep up and clean house.

Oh no, no I'm not going to put Bell in just in that court.

So it's all the big companies for sure.

And I would say american companies are probably more, I don't pay as much attention, but it's more ruthless whenever I go home to see my, my family, I love listening to Detroit radio.

I love listening to american radio because it's just different.

It's just, it feels so big, the production is so tight Even to this day and we're in 2021 right now, we still got like the crazy overnight guy, you know, that's still exist, that there's still a thing, you know, I listened to riff quite often because I've got a smart speaker in my room and I just asked for it and they play it, Oh yeah, you can do that nowadays, can't you?

Yeah, so I've got Dave and chuck the freak in the house every once in a while too.

It's funny because I, when I listen to them now, it's not the same.

I'm like, oh my sense of humor has changed quite a bit, but I respect what they do and I respect that they absolutely killin that both in Windsor in Detroit.

So what was working at the Chatham radio station, like I made a comeback there.

So my first internship was there when I was in Grade 13 or my lap here.

But then my first full time job was there, they hired me for Midei's and marketing in Chatham and they gave me a chance, right?

Like you just need, when you're at a radio school, just need someone to really give you a chance and they did.

I think I made, was I making like, we can talk about early day salaries, right?

It's fine.

Mine was 22,000 and 1989.

Okay.

To make you feel better.

Mine would have been 12, 13 years ago was $28,000.

That's barely any more than what you were making.

No, it's less.

No, I said 28, What'd you say?

22?

It's less by inflationary standards, right?

Yeah, exactly.

But it's exactly where I needed to start.

I didn't like, even though I grew up on a farm, I didn't like country music, but there's something, I don't know if you've worked in the country format, but there's something about the country format that makes you fall in love with it.

There's a lot of great songwriting, there's a lot of great lyrics, there's a lot of just good catchy beer drinking songs.

So that's where I fell in love with country music.

I had a really great team and what I love about it is that I'm still friends with those people and some of those people actually, a lot of them are still there and their legendary at this point, they put so much time in there and I admire that so much when I see people putting that much time into, it's like, it's unheard of nowadays to put more than a couple of years, six months into the station nowadays, right.

I successfully avoided country music radio.

I think I spun a couple of records all night on a station in nova Scotia at one point.

But overall I made fun of it, cracked a lot of jokes about it.

I spent most of my time in rock radio.

So tell me what I missed, you may argue me on this.

I will not argue this.

Just tell me what I missed.

So I would say half my career was spent, most of my career was spent country radio, worked in country in Ottawa for the entire eight years that I worked in radio here as well.

And the concerts and the artists are simply the best I would say because I've worked in pop and I've worked in rock.

So I'm not just like bias speaking.

I've worked in all the formats and most of the big major formats.

Right?

So I know or I think I know, but the artists are more accessible.

The Canadian talent is like on par with the american talent a lot of the time to, they're much more available.

Like I said, they're much more accessible for interviews and meet and greets and some of them actually just become your friends, which is great.

And then it comes to the actual concerts, I would say my favorite concert of all time was chris Stapleton at the Canadian tire center here in Ottawa.

The concerts are full of very, very passionate fans and you can't help but soak in that energy.

How'd you get to Ottawa Chatham to Sudbury?

Spent a few years in Sudbury?

Did you not know us?

No, I missed that part.

Is that on your linkedin?

It's on my Wikipedia page.

You have a Wikipedia page?

No, it's so funny.

It's like I've reconnected with a bunch of people lately, including some friends from Sudbury to, so I spent a few years in Sudbury and then I got a morning show job, the Rodger's station in Ottawa.

I mean that my partner at the time moved and he's in radio.

He's actually still currently in radio.

We're not together anymore.

But we packed our bags and moved to Ottawa and spent about a year, year and a half at the roger station.

Then bell flipped a country and, and I went over there and to drive for the rest of my radio career.

Well, what do you do in Sudbury?

What station?

I was at Q- 92.

So this is when I did rock.

Yes I thought there was a little rock in there.

Nice.

So tell me about the Sudbury experience by the way.

I just wanna like sidebar for a sec.

I love this because it digs up so many memories and so much emotion in both positive and negative, which is, I'm totally fine with and I love rehashing this.

This is great.

It's okay.

Question was how was suffering?

Yeah.

Give me the good and give me the bad, the good.

So did Midei's on Q 92.

I did a lot of the network stuff too.

At some point, I did three or four midday shows at one point, you know, North Bay, two Mins Sudbury.

And even though the whole situation there, I did mornings was the easy rock at the time or kiss.

I don't remember when it switched over, but I moved over to mornings to the pop situation.

The pop situation.

I love that.

I love pop music, top 40 music is like, what's the most of my champ to be honest, but it's not my favorite format to work in.

I'd like to think that I have a generic enough voice that I can work in any, in any format to be honest.

But some very, it was a great experience.

Glad I'm not there anymore.

Somewhere on a billboard.

They're going to put that up.

Sudbury.

Glad you're not here anymore.

Like with my face or just a generic, like some very experience for anybody who leads.

No, no, no, no, I, I don't want to bet like that just was like, I have a lot of friends, they're still and like it was my home for like three years and I loved it, but it's because I love Ottawa so much, even like get rid of the entire radio side.

I'm still here.

I'm not in radio anymore and I'm still here and I love it and that's the thing is like when you find a place that you're home, that is when you're like, oh no, this is where I'm meant to be, this is where I want to spend my time, this is where I want to hopefully spend the rest of my life.

And Sudbury is such a great radio market in terms of being able to grow your skills and get involved with the community as well.

It was great and like there were so many, I want to shout out to meld all do you know Mel Mel was there from the Q- 92 beginnings and when you have mentors like that and people who take you under your wing and who you could call literally any time and talk about radio to this.

If I called her probably today she would answer the phone and we have a wonderful chat.

Hilary Welch, who I absolutely love is still a friend to me today.

There's so many great people there like Gary Beach, Rich Griffin May he rest in peace.

I did a morning show with him and Gary, I feel bad because there's so many wonderful people there and I just don't want to just drop names and then miss people, but having mentors like that and friendships that will always last through hopefully the rest of my life, right, when you move away from home and you move by yourself and then you find a different kind of family.

I think that's one of the best things about radios.

It's, it's all these like people who come from different parts of the country who come together and become these little families.

Like I spent a lot of christmases and holidays away from my family because it was, you know, a 68 hour drive or in your case, you know, you have like a flight across the country.

So people take you under their wing and they take care of you and I'll never forget that and we'll always be grateful for that.

I figured that if you work in about three, maybe four Canadian markets after a while, Say another seven years passes.

You probably know somebody in just about every market across the country that you could drive across it and have a place to stay for a person to visit all the way to Vancouver.

I haven't even worked in Vancouver and I'm sure I could find someone who lives there now who's selling like fish on the, on the shore or something who left radio, who rescued you from Sudbury and got to Ottawa.

I was still in the Rogers family.

They took me to mornings.

So it was a morning show co host.

It's a big jump.

Well I was doing mornings and submarines.

So, but to Ottawa, Ottawa is a big city, it was a big city, right?

I mean it's a big jump because country in Ottawa and mornings.

It's big and I grew up next to it.

So I know it's a big deal.

Mhm.

And it was on the heritage station to write C K B Y.

Yes.

Yes, of course.

That's my point.

Like C K B Y 1053 was where it was located when I did my listening to it.

I didn't know or like a lot of country, but I could hear the radio station the seventies, eighties and nineties, At least the 80s and 90s and no, that's a big deal.

That's a big signal.

A lot of people are listening to this.

The problem was, it was one of the first morning shows after the legend.

It was Mark Pappas sack who was the morning show guy there for forever and looking back, you know, I'm glad I had that experience and that's where I am today.

But taking over a heritage show, it's almost like when you are dating and you date someone who like just broke out of a marriage, right?

Or out of a long term relationship.

You don't want to be the first one.

You don't want to be that first person, right?

So that's how I would compare after a Heritage morning show is being like the first people, I'm like, high, like I know that those people that you listened to literally forever and they were in your living room and your kitchen in your car For 2030 years, hey, is that a good comparison?

Do you think it's like David lee Roth after Howard Stern, we knew that wasn't going to last.

I think there's a lot of people pushing back right now on, on clay Travis and he's following up rush Limbaugh who past away and it's, it's not an easy act to follow and often it's short lived.

So when did the time at CK B Y and Rodgers abruptly end or change for you?

That would have been about six years ago because I remember not being happy.

Do people talk?

I was like, how deep do people go into these things?

We've had tears on this podcast before, so don't feel free to shut them, but it's, it sounds like you weren't happy.

I wasn't happy in the situation that I was in, not against anyone specifically, but it just wasn't where I wanted to be.

I loved the building.

Actually loved working for Rogers, I'm gonna be honest.

It was a really good company to work for when I was there and then I don't know if you know about this, but Bell accidentally announced that pure country was coming too soon by a billboard.

I think the billboards went up too early.

Do you remember that?

I do?

And I remember it was a mix of like me and my old boss would probably want to clarify this, It was a mix of me, like reaching out and be like, what is this?

And then being like, hey, and it took about three or four months to actually hire me because they were, you know, they flipped and then there was no announcers for awhile and they put the morning show in and then they finally hired me for drive and then I can't, you know, legally talk about necessarily what happened behind the scenes.

But essentially I was on the morning show at country 1111 day and then the next day I was doing drive At it was new country 94 and then switched up your country.

But it was like very like super fast.

And there was dealings behind the scenes that I will never understand, but they tell you like, hey, today is your last day and then you get another call saying, hey, tomorrow is your first day.

You don't get time off.

Like you're just dragged around like a sack of potatoes and you're told what to do, right?

But it was exciting.

It was really exciting to try something new and I don't think I've ever done drive at that point and drive ended up being my favorite shift in radio.

If I was to ever go back at any point, who knows, dr is my favorite shift and I will argue that until my death is the best shift in radio.

I know some people adjust well kudos to you, but my former partner who's, I know he's still doing mornings or like any of my friends still doing mornings, like that's so hard on the body.

That's so hard at the mental space.

But some people are really good at it.

You mentioned though that after a period of time when you were at Rogers, you've been doing mornings in Sudbury, then you've been doing it in Ottawa.

Could it be that just mornings was just incredible wear and tear on you that, you know, I'm done here and then you go to afternoons and things brighten up again.

Is that possible?

You're accurate on that 100% accurate on that because then you kind of get your life back.

You're not tired as much anymore.

I would spend my mornings in Gatineau Park here in skiing or hiking or trail running or doing whatever and then I would go and do my show in the afternoon and I still live like in the same neighborhood as, as a station.

And it's just super convenient And you know, of course there's all those other things like there's a community work and there's, well, not Tiktok's back then.

There's so much other work that goes into that too, right.

But at least you're well slept and you have another life, you're able to like have a balance.

Yeah.

And also you get more sunlight makes you happier and Ottawa is not an easy place to, uh, you know, to do winter because it's cloudy a lot.

There's a lot of snow and it's damp and it can be a little bit depressing.

There's something about that vitamin D.

That just gives you a little shot.

You know, you do mornings, you're about who the hell knows when and then you're working and you're like, I'm tired and then like you're freaking napping at one p.m.

You nap like half the daylight away and then it's dark at two.

I'm exaggerating only slightly in just a second.

We talk about mental health, future opportunities, having control of your life and doing what you want to do and making that transition out of radio and into the voice over world.

But before she gets there, she shares her experience of her most recent radio gig and there's more, oh, there's always more at sound off podcast dot com.

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How was the pure country experience in Ottawa for you removing the part about how it ended, which we'll get to.

Thanks for bringing this up.

It feels like almost like a bookend.

That's how I look at it.

I'm so grateful for that experience And I was on that station and did afternoons, 99% of the time I had a quick little stint in the morning show, but to do afternoons and to build an audience and to build myself into the community, and you know, the benefit of working at the Bell station here is they have like, they have the talk station, the FcF ray, they have the C.

T.

V.

Stations, they have like several radio stations.

It's great because you all work together, you do charity events together, you, I did tv appearances, so you've got a really good, vast experience of things and I'd love to hear your theory on this too.

But I was realizing, you know, as I was approaching my thirties and early 30s that I was like, I don't know if I can do this forever, I don't know what radio looks like.

It's scary seeing your friends laid off and people that you adore, laid off every year, twice a year and not just bell every company and things get growing smaller and smaller and people being pushed to the edge and that was really scary and I was like, you know, I could probably do it like let's see what happens, like maybe I'll do another five years here, we're in a pandemic.

Everyone's kind of languishing.

I wasn't super happy at the end, but that was like, I thought it was just pandemic related.

I thought it was just like I'm working from home, I'm not around any, like this is so hard, I love people and I didn't have events and it was really tough, but that choice was made for me.

So I'm thinking about that building and we've had some people on this podcast who have been through there, Liane Lang comes to mind, you know, milkman, he was, you know, at 93 9, albeit he was probably before your time.

Yeah, I know, yeah, I know him, but there were a lot of people though, you're right, twice a year, there would be a round of layoffs and I always saw that whenever there were layoffs in Ottawa for either the Rodger's station or the Bell station, people in Ottawa, I love how they get their back up and they go, why does Ottawa get treated like sh it and why does Toronto seem to sort of avoid all this?

Because it really, honestly, whenever the layoffs come, it feels like Toronto is picking on Ottawa for this sort of thing.

But then you see, like there's a lot of layoffs in Toronto, I would say in the last last couple of rounds I think, and then you see, you know, the TsN stations being slashed and again, it's not just bell, it's, it's everywhere too.

But that, that anxiety of it's november, it's terrible that, you know what month it is right, it's, it's not okay, like that's not okay.

No, it totally messes with the mental health of performers that twice a year there's going to be a round of layoffs, I think it's May and november, Generally the 3rd Week of November, you know what's terrible is it was just like a month ago, you know, I'm not as involved, like I don't think about it anymore.

Really.

I'm like, oh, it's november.

Like the fact that I still thought about it, I want to be careful with what I'm saying here, but it's just the machine, It's not specific people who are doing these things.

It's the bigger, broader spectrum of like the industry.

Yeah, I would, I would love your thoughts on kind of maybe where you think it's because a lot of obviously a lot of radio people still listen to this.

I am like I had other radio offers this year, you know, so I got laid off in february and and other radio offers.

I'm like, no, no, no.

My gut was like try something else first, try doing something else first and I will never say never, you never know what's going to happen.

But my gut was just telling me to try something else and I'm so glad that I have, I was so scared of where the industry is headed or going and I think there will always be a place for radio.

But it also like makes me sad because I did it for 12 years.

So there's two components to this.

And as your therapist, I am going to be charged with $195, I just need transferred you thank you.

The practical side of it is I was offered a chance to go back into radio and I didn't take it because I'm like, I'll get let go in two years and then I'm going to be two years behind what I'm doing now.

The emotional or the psychological side of it is I don't want to be involved in an organization where I have to look over my shoulder every six months and make plans for what could happen in May or in november.

That causes a lot of stress, stress causes cancer.

I don't want to die of cancer.

I know I'm laughing but not like I'm not like I'm not laughing, I'm laughing because it's uncomfortable.

It's true stress causes cancer and you'll get cancer and die if you keep this up, some people might be able to shut this out.

I'm not one of those persons.

So I got out, you've been like a mentor for me and I really appreciate that and we've had a lot of great conversations, but you know that like this year has been incredibly difficult for me as I repurposed my life and figure out what the hell am I doing next and how do I take my skills and make money off of that?

But the anxiety, I feel bad for even saying it to friends who are still in radio, we're stressed about this or tv or media, but the anxiety of not knowing when your clock is running out is almost worse.

That anxiety, the unknown.

I think it's because again, back to therapy for a second, I think it's because lack of control is because you're not deciding that someone else might or the bigger picture might be like we have to cut, we have to cut, we have to cut.

There's no person behind the cuts.

We all know it's an algorithm.

Are you sure it's not just like a claw machine and they like have someone's name written on each of the stuff he's and then they just like pull it.

I think it's Shirley Jackson's the lottery.

It's just a dot on a piece of paper.

We both know there's rhyme and reason and it's people who decide this are people we've never met and we'll never talk to in our entire lives.

So it is what it is.

This is the most I've talked about this openly and in public before.

It's really uh so awkward.

It's a little tough.

So what do you do in the days and months after February 2021 when you were let go.

It's a lot of a blur.

It was tough.

I don't know if we were in lockdown, but you know, no vaccines weren't readily available yet.

I had wonderful friends and people drop things off for me.

I'd occasionally see one or two friends, but there was no going out partying or there was no going out drinks for friends.

There was none of that february was maybe the hardest month of my life.

So the layoff happens again, coldest darkest, like one of the darkest months in a pandemic, no vaccines or like minimal vaccines at that point for people severe.

I would say like the darkest mental health space I have ever been in in my life.

I will straight up say it was depression, anxiety and I'm still like seeking help for that.

I have no problem saying that at all.

And I still have moments that where I'm like, what am I doing with my life?

It takes a very severe hit to the confidence and the ego and the what happened if anyone who's been laid off before knows that you get paperwork for months?

There's constant reminders, there's constant reminders of what happened, luckily, you know, I know I can say this, but you know, you get a severance when you're there for long enough.

So at least you have a little bit of stability for an X amount of time, right?

So there was that.

But then there was a combination of, I had never been on the phone more and video chats and connecting with people virtually because I was just picking brains.

I mean like what do I want to do?

What am I good at?

What am I going to do next?

There was a point where I was interviewing for charity, like really great charities here.

I've had interviews at the college here.

So there was all these really cool opportunities.

But I had this like deep, loud voice in my head saying like do something on your own, try it yourself, try like you'll be in complete control.

I think it was a really hard swing the opposite way from working for a corporation for so long that you're like no, I want to do it myself.

Why did you call me?

I don't remember who recommended you, it might have been a consultant who I was talking to, who said you should chat with matt Cundill, it's Dave Farough, Yes, thank you.

I'm like who was it?

I was connecting with consultant because I wasn't sure if what way I wanted to go.

Dave told me to connect with you and that's how you and I became friends but you drunk dialed me the first time, that's an awkward way to start a relationship.

I was doing a lot of drunk dialing those days, I think it was hard and it's been the hardest year of my life and honestly just reinventing yourself, I'm so glad I'm doing it now because I'm still full of life and energy and you know, finding that purpose and I have so many working hours ahead of me and it's a great time, I don't have kids, I don't have a partner, so I'm in complete control of my life and I feel like that might be rare in the future, so there's no better time to do exactly what I want to do and I'm going to fully take advantage of that, it's liberating, isn't it, even though, and I'm sure we'll get you the voice over stuff, but even though december was the slowest month of my business so far and I had moments of like I'm a failure, I only had a streak of luck, This isn't going to work, what am I doing with myself here?

I still feel in my soul heart, whatever way you want to put it, that I'm doing the right thing for me right now and that there is, this may sound bigger, but like, like then than me by any means, but like there is always an end to everything, nothing lasts forever.

You can change your mind.

I feel privileged enough that I have enough support from family and friends and not everyone has that, but I am privileged enough and I want to recognize that that I will always have a roof over my head and I will always have food on the table.

So I feel okay enough about taking swings and taking chances.

So I feel lucky enough to be able to do that and taking a little bit of that severance money and reinvesting it into your new business.

So tell me about your new business, No, actually right in the crypto, I took my entire sovereign to put into crypto and then you sold that and then you reinvest.

It was such a blur this year that I don't even know how I ended up here, like, I actually don't know how I even made that choice other than taking a risk and being like, I think I can do this.

I had friends like kind of an engineering world who helped me with like a basic setup, which was super helpful.

You've answered questions for me, other people.

Industry have helped me to.

Next thing.

You know, I'm getting this the 416 and like a month into my official business and I write, I'm like, I'm all in on this.

So august I officially started, I'm like, I'm gonna do voice over work.

I don't know where I'm going to make my money.

I don't know how or what I'm going to be, who's going to hire me.

But it's actually working and there's no better feeling.

Please validate me on this.

There's no better feeling than creating something completely on your own and getting paid for it and getting paid half decent for it.

It's like this crazy validation.

There's a book written back in mid-2000's I think it's called ask and you shall receive.

It was written by a physicist in Montreal and it was a very simple notion that if you want something to happen in life all you have to do is ask because if you don't ask, nothing happens.

So somewhere between tell somebody that you're doing this or ask if you can do this ask and you shall receive.

And I think once you started to ask and tell people about what you're doing, then you started to get some business.

Well thank you by the way you've funded a bit of that.

I appreciate that.

I'm going to overlook the fact by the way that you bought that super sexy microphone in literally months.

Yes, six months or something like that.

It took me six years to save up to get mine.

But you got yours right out of the gate.

Good work.

No, I did, I did it more for, because everyone was telling me you should try it.

Your voice is good for it.

But it's just like a $1400 mike.

So stupid.

But I would say it was the best investment for me.

I don't want to say it's good for everyone.

But like for me it was the best investment I could have made even though I hadn't made like any money at that point, I was like, nope, I'm gonna take what I have and spend it on this and put in my next upgrade would have to be, I work in a closet studio at this point.

So my next point, I'm like, I just don't know, I don't know how I'm gonna upgrade that.

I haven't figured that out yet.

Oh, it's simple.

You just got to go down to value village and by puffy addresses to pad out the closet.

You would be alarmed to see my, to see this and I'm like, I can't believe I made this as much money as I have in this stupid little setup.

It's so funny.

But you know, the setup in the recording studio as long as you can get it sounding okay.

Like it doesn't matter if you recorded in the closet.

Some of the best podcasts I know are recorded in closets and odd spaces and under pillows and you know, eventually we're going to be able to travel again and you're going to get very, very good at building pillow forts, which will double down as recording studios.

I have done one already at home.

I'll send you a picture later.

I did one the last time I was home to see my family, I did an entire like relaxation training course and that thing.

But I remember it was David Tyler, I was on one of his sessions.

He said he had recorded some imaging with this microphone in like a hotel room before.

So I think I knew I'm like, okay, that's right.

That like this is, will hopefully be again David Tyler and I do not have the same voice.

But that gave me hope that I made the right choice on that.

And for context.

David Tyler is the voice at bell for CTV news across the country.

So he's the voice you hear before lisa Laflamme comes on to give you all the bad news of the day.

David, by the way, runs a monthly, I guess get together on zoom called office hours.

It's for voice over talent.

I'll put a link in the show notes for anybody who does want to come and join us because I encourage you to come join it.

And it's a great place for voice over people to get started.

Or even experienced voiceover people to come and just listen and share their knowledge.

Yeah, I've been a couple of times and spent a really good resource and I feel like such, oh my gosh, I feel like such an amateur.

But I'm also realizing that I have to carve my own path and figure it out myself at the same time.

I love getting advice and I love it.

But there are things that are working for me that I'm going to keep doing and I'm gonna keep going with and there are other things I need to, to navigate.

What are some of the things that you learned about voiceover that you didn't know, Let's say you're back at your country doing afternoons and then, you know, the voiceover business exists.

But what have you learned along the way to go, Oh, I didn't know that.

It is insanely competitive.

It's very competitive.

I would say is the number one thing I didn't realize how much.

So that's the biggest thing, a lot of it is marketing and a lot of it is reaching out.

So something that I'm going to toot my own horn on this is that I've always been good at talking to people.

I've always been good at reaching out.

I have no problem cold calling people and I think that's actually one of the reasons I've been successful, like I'd like to think that I'm good enough and talented enough, that's confidence and maybe cockiness, who knows?

But I also know that I'm really good at like the sales and marketing, it's not my favorite thing in the world, but I know that I love talking to people and I love connecting with people.

I mean like what do you need and what do you want?

Something I realized I'm loving is that and this is this is new because you're so like in radio, you've always been in the spotlight right?

To a something, you know, lowest rung of celebrity, right?

That's what I say is like, people like you're a celebrity and like, no, that's like the lowest possible.

It's very low on the, on the ladder, it's actually no longer the lowest we have instagram influencer now.

Below that is top of the list Now, that is what people want to be influencers.

People are making a ton of money doing that.

I think people are figuring out that it's fake, I don't disagree with you.

So something I'm realizing that I'm loving is that I don't care anymore.

Of course I'm my own brand and my my own voice, but I'd much rather be a voice or the voice of a brand for someone else and showcase my talent because it's not about me, like in radio, it's all about you and your personality and connecting with people and like, that is something I actually don't miss at all.

I have completely removed myself from it, like, okay, here's my product, this is what I can offer you.

How can I make your product or your commercial or your explainer video, you're blowing, like come to life.

What sort of voice over project have you done that?

You didn't even know existed?

So I I guess I knew it existed, but I didn't realize that it was even a thing for signing a contract purposes.

I can't say what it is, but I'm a voice on a Children's learning app.

That's cool.

I don't know if I'm the main voice, but I know that I've done hundreds of lines and there's some probably like some five year old and I'm like abc so that's super cool.

That's one of my more favorite ones, something I'm surprised by is the amount of times I see in auditions that says, no radio announcer voice real person.

And what's funny is, you know, how hard it is to sound like a real person.

It's a huge challenge.

A lot of people get out of radio and think, well I read 30s every day in the studio.

So, and then, you know, you get out and people want a narration, they don't want a 32nd commercial, read, they want a real person.

They want touchy feely.

They want, you know, the big request is, can you make that more conversational?

Yes.

I think I saw like a voices dot com put out.

So they put up this like this graph chart of the most requested and it was like the biggest piece of the pie was real person of what people wanted.

I would say that's, that's been a big challenge.

Is figuring out where where do I fitness, what do I like to do again?

A little bit of a sidebar.

I would like to call out several men that I've been on first dates with.

I was gonna say I was on a voiceover question, but no, keep going.

No, it's voiceover, It's voiceover related or it's like dating apps and you're like, you're all in, you're like leaning it.

I love this.

Several men, like not just one, it's like been multiple men who have said, oh, you do voice over.

I've always wanted to do that on the side.

I have a pretty deep voice.

Could you help me set it up?

No acting experience, no professional speaking experience.

And I'm sure there's people who make a success of it without that, but like the amount of like blind blind entry to the industry and it's always got like, I'm not, I'm not going on dates with girls.

And I've had radio people and I have media people and I'm like, yes, I want to help you and people I already know who are like, hey I might want to do that on the side or I might want to do that.

And that's different than like random dudes.

I don't I don't really know.

It's almost like diminishes all of the literally hundreds and hundreds of hours I've put into this business in the last since august and it's just like oh I can just do that on the side and make a bunch of cash.

No you can't.

It's very competitive and very hard and it's a whole other skill.

I sound a little bitter.

Maybe we should have a talk about why you're going out on dates with people who are burning date time and they're trying to get you to elevate their career, which is not going to happen in voiceover.

That seems like a weird way to spend your date time.

Well there wasn't a second, I don't think there's second dates for most of those and they're mostly innocent.

Like it's very innocent requests but I'm actually so alarmed at how many people are just like I've already voiced.

I think I can do it.

Like I don't people don't even want to hear a deep voice anymore.

I actually I want to show you his name's Adam.

Ramsey, my friend Brittany Brittany Thompson who's a program director at Bell here in Ottawa and half of Eastern Ontario hooked me up with him.

So Adam has been a really good mentor for me, he's out in P.

I.

He is a successful voiceover artist.

He has like 50 jobs though.

He's just one of those people that seems to be good at everything.

I've never met Adam but he's been wonderful to me this year and he's got like a very kind of like a normal guy voice.

But he told me, I mean I hope he won't mind me sharing this.

But he got like a Nintendo ad like very early in his I think on Voices dot com he got a Nintendo add within like the first very soon after he joined.

But like that's just proof that they just want normal voices or like those nerdier techie voices right?

That it doesn't have to be the big booming rock guy, which I'm sure you've done in your past.

Yeah.

I don't get any requests for deep reads anymore.

I just get, can you sound more normal?

Can you sound like a human, can you be more warm?

Can you be nicer?

At one point it was very deep and and a lot of movie trailer type stuff and I don't get requests for that anymore.

People just want a real person.

Yeah.

Even circling back to that that like that's one of the biggest things is what people want and I've started to become already pickier with what I'm auditioning for but also seeing what I'm getting hired for and what I'm good at.

It's a mix of like, what do I like doing, but then also, uh what am I getting hired for?

And I'm like, I'm surprising myself all the time and like, oh, I didn't know that, that's what someone would want me for.

What are you good at the surprised you?

It always seems to be like the audition that I'm like, I totally screwed that up that you get jobs for, which I think is funny.

I'm finding I'm getting hired for a lot of like, techie kind of explainer videos.

I didn't realize that that's where, but I guess I have a millennial voice, so it kind of suits perfectly.

I thought it would be like, and I've done some bigger commercials, which has been really cool and fun, like in the fashion world.

So I'm not surprised.

I'm not surprised by that.

I really like that.

But yeah, it's more like the explainer stuff and like things I didn't again, didn't really know existed that you would even need a voiceover for that's really prevalent.

Congratulations by the way, on the launch of the business, the website is now up the facebook age, people have to like that facebook page.

I literally just launched it.

The facebook page.

Yeah, thanks so much for coming on the podcast to tell your story.

Thank you for asking me and being interested in doing.

So appreciate it.

The sound off podcast is written and hosted by matt Cundill produced by Evan Surminski Social media by Courtney Krebsbach, another great creation from the sound off Media company, imaging courtesy Core Image Studios.

There's always more at sound off podcast dot com.